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'Lostprophets' Ian Watkins on child sex offence charges'

Discussion in 'Music Chat' started by Kink, Dec 19, 2012.

  1. Tom Russia

    Tom Russia New Member

    It's not gut reaction, though, is it? You've actively chosen to post it on an internet forum, which requires conscious thought. I wasn't trying to tell you how to feel, and you're perfectly entitled to feel however you want. Anyway, I was in two minds about posting the above comment and kind of wish I hadn't now, so I'll bow out here.
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  3. performingchimp

    performingchimp New Member

    Yeah. Read my posts and respond to those. They are intended to challenge some elements of your gut reaction.

    Does you reaction to this story matter?

    It's shocking to think of and horrible to conceive, but if my (hypothetical) children were ever to be abused it would almost certainly be by someone I know. So my reaction to paedophilia could actually be a deciding factor in protecting my children. For example, if my spouse knew I would hate them for their urges, they would never confess them to me.

    These are the things we have to face up to. Hoping Ian Watkins dies in jail or whatever is utterly futile.
  4. sheila

    sheila New Member

    You know what? Forget it. Forget what I've posted. I'm out.
  5. Seany

    Seany Active Member

    Favourite Bands:
    !!!, Can, Mars Volta
    C'mon guys work together on this, if we can't, what hope has the rest of the world?
  6. Matt_Bentley

    Matt_Bentley Member

    We're hardly the cream of humanity.

    Anyway, I really don't feel qualified to comment on any of this beyond that but I'll have a stab. My natural reaction is horror and a feeling intensely sorry for his victims. I don't think he should die or that he's inherently evil - something makes a person that way.

    However, he has sunk lower than all but the most depraved, is dangerous and needs to be locked up. How long for is a matter for the courts. It's therefore easy to understand gut reactions, even if you don't condone them. Additionally, the mob mentality you see in the social sphere upsets me.

    My initial reaction to Sheila's original post was that it was part of this mob mentality. However, if she has personal experience of this sort of thing and this story has genuinely upset her then who the hell am I to make any kind of judgement. I don't have experience of this and, I sincerely hope, I never will, so it's extremely easy for me to remain objective and feel aloof and superior.

    This is a trap, and if I allowed myself to fall into it, that would make me a dick.
  7. stevecreek

    stevecreek New Member

    I definitely think this is the kind of thing that needs to be brought to the general conversation about paedophilia in society. It's a view that I only began to think about when I found out that a guy I went to school with went to jail for his illegal involvement with a girl over the internet. That humanised paedophilia for me, because I knew this guy and knew he was a nice person.

    The Watkins case is very strange, I think partly because of the life he was leading. From reading about the case, it sounds like he had huge power over people - mainly young women - for a long time, was allowed to indulge any urges he felt like and take them to obscene extremes. When you just read the headline about him being a twisted paedophile, it misses out the context of him also being a man whose life - and in particular his sex life - were vastly different from the majority of people and also paedophiles.

    While what he did is incomprehensibly awful, it makes me wonder if he would have turned out like he has if he hadn't been given all that power, all those drugs, all those unchecked situations where girls offered themselves to him. I've no idea if he was a violent, abusive person before all that came along.

    All of that might not be relevant, but it seems to me that scrutinising people who have that much power over other, vulnerable, often young people is also something that needs to happen more and be talked about more.
  8. wallum

    wallum Member

    Favourite Bands:
    Kate Bush
    I'd imagine what is more likely is that he was the victim of some sexual trauma himself at a formative age and (despite his obvious desire to push boundaries) it was something akin the norm for him in adult life hence his comment about 'nobody getting hurt.' Having said that, access to people willing to facilitate his abuse plays it's part in the whole affair as well. .
  9. performingchimp

    performingchimp New Member

    I hope you don't feel bullied off the thread, I'm sure that wasn't Tom's intention and it certainly wasn't mine.

    However, I totally understand why you or anyone would bail on this thread, I haven't really got anything more to say on it either. This is really a horrible subject and the skin is crawling up and down my neck each time I post on it.

    I'll fess up too - I do secretly deep down hope he gets killed in jail. I do feel that. I just don't want to make that my whole reaction, because I can be aware that I feel that anger and vengefulness but also be aware that my emotions are more complex than that, and that I have in my life felt compassion more strongly than I have ever felt anger.
  10. bongobenny

    bongobenny Well-Known Member

    There's no negative feeling from Tom there as far as I could see he just didn't agree with Sheila's point. Always a good counterpoint in debate this....Could you imagine if that happened in parliament..'Well I don't agree with you Mr Cameron, I'm bowing out'
  11. tome

    tome Active Member

    No, I think you have every right to express your gut reaction and the response to that by some others shows a distinct lack of empathy.

    There's no use saying that expressing a gut reaction about Watkins is unhelpful because if it helps Sheila then it merits no further comment from anyone else. It's a blind alley.
  12. performingchimp

    performingchimp New Member

    That ignores the basic fact that a person is expressing their reaction, but they are doing to us. People here are the intended recipients of their words.

    Everyone is entitled to express their reaction to events and to the contents of this thread, the only person suggesting that they are not is you.
  13. Hanson

    Hanson Member

    Favourite Bands:
    Big Dogs
    The bloke spat in a baby's anus with a view to bumming it. Read that again. I can completely understand people wanting the fucker dead. Too much judging going on here. Take a step back chaps, you are the good ones, give each other a hug.
  14. Hanson

    Hanson Member

    Favourite Bands:
    Big Dogs

    This is ace, incidentally.
  15. Rock and Roll Circus

    Rock and Roll Circus Member

    Favourite Bands:
  16. Tom Russia

    Tom Russia New Member

    Just wanted to point out that I think what I said here might have been misinterpreted a little (the second sentence) - it kind of reads back differently to how I meant it.

    The second sentence was meant to mean something to the effect of "it's not your job to come up with a proper solution and that's fair enough". It reads more sarcastic than that, maybe, which wasn't my intention.

    Anyway, I hope I haven't upset anyone too much. Personally, I don't think death or unconditional life imprisonment is ever the answer but that is only my opinion.
  17. Damian

    Damian New Member

  18. Staypuff

    Staypuff Active Member

    I think the reason why people are posting their reactions on here is because they can, we may not be "the cream of society" but neither are we the people who will be assaulting a paediatrician. It's just a way of coping, of trying to contextualise this. I cannot even begin to process what he did because I can't relate to it, I cannot imagine what make anyone do what he, or more specifically, they did.
  19. stevecreek

    stevecreek New Member

    Totally agree. It's hard to process stuff like this, but it really helps to discuss it.

    I also think the whole thread is representative of exactly the kind of conversation that should be happening about this case and the issues around it.
  20. pinkizzy+

    pinkizzy+ New Member

    Favourite Bands:
    Save prison arts

    From Adam Mac - HMP Wakefield

    The many effects of the new IEP policy have been widely published in Inside Time, including articles about how it will affect prisoners maintaining their innocence, how it will change what is expected of prisoners, and how it will result in prisoners losing certain items of property. However, there has been little said about how the new policy affects prison arts. The popularity of the Koestler Awards demonstrates how much talent there is in prisons, and how varied that talent is. Whether you paint or draw, play the guitar or build matchstick models, write poetry or prose, fiction or non-fiction, self expression is extremely important to prisoners. It offers us a chance to break free of the brick walls and metal doors and fill our time with something productive. But the introduction of the new IEP policy threatens all that. The Ministry of Justice have already confirmed that they intend to take away all electric guitars and any acoustic guitars which have metal strings; Prisoners up and down the country are frequently blocked or delayed in ordering paints or hobby items such as veneer; and many prisoners have even reported that their own writing has been removed from their possession by security without any reason being given at all. It seems like the arts in prison are under attack and, unless we can convince the Ministry of Justice to give prison arts the respect and importance they deserve, we may end up losing them altogether. I have been blogging atadammac.co.uk since December and, last month, I put out a post asking my readers to help campaign against this. I received a lot of encouragement as a result and I'm pleased to say that we have now set up an online petition, asking the Ministry of Justice to recognise the value of prison arts, to ensure that arts materials and equipment are available to all prisoners, and to provide personal development and arts courses across the prison estate. However, most prisoners will be unable to access the website in order to sign this. Instead we are reliant on those on the other side of the wall. Our friends. Our family. If you know anyone outside who can spare just two minutes of their time to help save prison arts, get them on the website. It's very easy and, together, we can make a real difference. The web address for the petition is: you.38degrees.org.uk/petitions/save-prison-arts or you can access it via my blog at adammac.co.uk If we don't sta
  21. pinkizzy+

    pinkizzy+ New Member

    Favourite Bands:
    I hope Ian Watkins participates in this program as part of his rehabilitation, he should feel remorse for what he has done. and realise he is a shameful excuse for a human being. I don't like using ''evil" or "monster" to describe a serious criminal because these words only exist in science fiction and fantasy novels...this is real life.

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